View Full Version : Rules / Regeln
megatron
20.09.2002, 03:25
The wk2ammo Team would like to make the following statement:
This forum is slowly but surely turning in to a real international forum.
This means that ammunition shown by the members in this forum may be legal to own in one country but illegal in an other.
We expect and trust that the members acquire and possess their ammunition in the appropiate manner and according to the local regulations.
The possession of illegal ammunition and/or related items will damage the reputation of all
collectors and could possibly endanger the health of others.
So beware...
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Das wk2ammo Team teilt folgendes mit:
Dieses Forum wird langsam aber sicher zu einem richtigen internationalem Forum.
Dies bedeutet, das gezeigte Munition in dem einem Land zugelassen in einem Anderen aber verboten sein kann!
Wir erwarten und vertrauen unseren Mitgliedern, das sie die Munition die sie vorzeigen auch nach ihren lokalen Gesetzen besitzen dürfen.
Der Besitz von verbotener Munition und/oder der in verbindung stehender Einzelteile schädigt den Ruf aller Sammler und könnte die Gesundheit dritter eventuell gefährden!
also passen Sie auf...
Dutch members only !!!!
Nederlandse leden die munitie, dan wel delen van munitie laten zien, dienen in het bezit te zijn van een machtiging tot het in bezit hebben van munitie (WM10), voorzover deze delen onder de Wet Wapens en Munitie vallen.
Van die leden die tevens lid zijn van de NVBMB word verwacht dat zij zich ook hier gedragen volgens de regels van de NVBMB.
Het tonen van scherpe cat. 2 munitie is alleen toegestaan indien het desbetreffende lid in het bezit is van een ontheffing en/of lid is van de EOD.
Bij overtreding van deze regels word de geschreven bijdrage gewist en volgt een waarschuwing, bij herhaaldelijke overtreding word de overtreder geschorst.
megatron, zünder,
Mij request for answers about a handgrenade has been removed. It's Oké for me. I did not tell the photo was taken about 10 minutes before the grenade was blown up bij the EOCKL. I took the photo with their accoord.
Hallo Hi
Censure is never a solution , and a danger for the interrest of this excellent forum.
A picture cannot damage.
Some picture can bring a lot of informations .
Is it possible to send the "censured and extremely dangerous pictures" to an official eod member of this forum who will bring them in the forum ?
I do not agree.
Those who choose to bring themselves and other in danger are not the responsebility of this forum.
The beauty of this forum lies in the high quality of those who are writing, and every single one of these authors knows what is allowed, and what is legal or illegal.
At least i hope that's the case....
Those who collect and study ammunition, always have to work under the sceptic eye of the law.
Our reputation is allready damaged by the metal detectorists who take everything home and ask questions later, and those who take up a wrench and start working on a live shell without proper knowledge and without proper papers.
In my opinion, this jeopardisis everything the serious collector is striving for: studying and collecting ammunition, within the confinement of the law, and with a rightfull and accepted place in society.
The responsible collectors know better then to search in the field, they know better then to deactivate stuff themselves.
And especially in these difficult times, where governements cry havoc about anything weaponsrelated we should be very , very carefull.
You call it censureship, which i think is a wrong choice of words, i call it monitoring.
It's not a danger to the interests of this forum, showing live ammunition is ; it will damage our reputation as responsable collectors.
Sending pictures to the official eod members is not a solution, in that case, those who dig for ammunition and want an answer will still be rewarded for their illegal actions by giving them the proper information.
If they want to learn about ammunition, let them buy the right books and read the topics here, that will give them at least some knowledge without being a danger to themselves and their surroundings.
Censure is never a solution , and a danger for the interrest of this excellent forum.
Hard words, but of course, every moderated Forum ist censured.
For those running wk2ammo it is very difficult to seperate the guys, who know what they do from those, who just think, they know what they are doing.
So the seperation into guys, who are allowed to do, what they do (even if they don't know, what they do...) and those who are not allowed is more practicable and keeps the forum and its moderators safe.
Just keep it the way, it is.
I really like this excellent forum and of course the difference between wk2ammo and other sides in the net.
Of course a picture cannot damage and some picture can bring a lot of informations. But wk2ammo has to be aware, not to loose its standarts.
Sometimes you sit in front of your PC and just have a nervous breakdown after regarding a threat like "this I have found yesterday, can anybody tell me, what it is?" in another forum, with a photo of a dud 8,8 cm AT-Grenade with 5127 fuze, taken at home on the kitchen-table... :shock:
And if you send a
"censured and extremely dangerous pictures" to an official eod member of this forum , he will of course first try to answer your question himself ("Hey, I'm official EOD-Member, I should know"), but if he can't, he will put it in the Forum for you - and for himself, to rise his knowledge, thats the reason why I'm here!
Greetings
Bob
official eod member, allowed to do, what he does and thinking that he knows what he is doing.
And if the picture is old , 10 years , 30 years , 100 years ... It must be censured ?
Where are the limits ?
Censure is the ennemy of intelligence and freedom , at the beginning pictures and at last idees .
This sort of material is done for the war and destruction , then it could be good for the society and to save the world to censure totaly this forum and bring the members in jail ....
If i show the pulver of a 3.7 cm case is it a danger for the planet ?
Adults must be considered as children in this world ?
The important is the limit .
If it is to bring a scoop or a rare information , IT MUST BE SHOWN .
If it is to learn something dangerous it can be censured .
Those who collect and study ammunition, always have to work under the sceptic eye of the law.
Our reputation is allready damaged by the metal detectorists who take everything home and ask questions later, and those who take up a wrench and start working on a live shell without proper knowledge and without
And especially in these difficult times, where governements.... ; it will damage our reputation as responsable collectors.
Ok zünder i understand of course ,
but for one or two idiots who make dangerous things , we , hundreds of good citizens , we loose the most important : the freedom to speak and show and learn ...
There is no censorship, and therefor it is forbidden to claim, that there is censorship ...
kz11gr, I think, that using the word censorship for the rules of this homepage is not the right one, as Zünder wrote, it is a sort of monitoring.
Believe me, the very most of the members here are responsible, have an excellent knowledge (which I like to cream off) and are not interested in anything against society. But a look to other Internetpages, especially those for "treasure-hunters" will show you, that there are a very lot of people handling ammunition, who are not allowed to and - that is the most dangerous thing - don't have a bit of idea, what they are doing there.
And those pages are full of "what is this" questiones with pictures of ammunition, that obviously has been handled or even removed to the home.
The runners of a homepage are responsible for their homepage, and in times, when compagnies are condemned for not warning the users, not to dry their cats in microwave-ovens, I don't want to know what will happen to the responsible persons of a homepage, when someone is killed by old ammunition and has got the answer to his "What is this"-question from the homepage.
Maybe, the judge consideres just this answer should habe been handled as
If it is to learn something dangerous it can be censured .
See it as what it really is: a safety for megatron, Zünder, mag etc.
They shurely do not want to cut your right of information, ideas and so on.
And writing private notes is not forbidden ...
greetings
Bob
There is no censorship, and therefor it is forbidden to claim, that there is censorship ...
kz11gr, I think, that using the word censorship for the rules of this homepage is not the right one, as Zünder wrote, it is a sort of monitoring.
Believe me, the very most of the members here are responsible, have an excellent knowledge (which I like to cream off) and are not interested in anything against society. But a look to other Internetpages, especially those for "treasure-hunters" will show you, that there are a very lot of people handling ammunition, who are not allowed to and - that is the most dangerous thing - don't have a bit of idea, what they are doing there.
And those pages are full of "what is this" questiones with pictures of ammunition, that obviously has been handled or even removed to the home.
The runners of a homepage are responsible for their homepage, and in times, when compagnies are condemned for not warning the users, not to dry their cats in microwave-ovens, I don't want to know what will happen to the responsible persons of a homepage, when someone is killed by old ammunition and has got the answer to his "What is this"-question from the homepage.
Maybe, the judge consideres just this answer should habe been handled as
If it is to learn something dangerous it can be censured .
See it as what it really is: a safety for megatron, Zünder, mag etc.
They shurely do not want to cut your right of information, ideas and so on.
And writing private notes is not forbidden ...
greetings
Bob
Ok Munibob .
Perhaps i am the only one against all .
But , i stay on my opinion.
And i stay on the side of the liberty to speak and show , and on the side of freedom .
Censorship gives always good reasons (always to "protect" people .... and believe who wants to believe.
I will respect the "rules" but i keep my opinion.
Don't forget that in some countries like USSR the newspapers had difficulties (or were vorbidden) with an other sort of monitoring.
Perhaps can we all together vote to find a better arrangment ?
I've never ever considered it as a way to protect the team, the sole reason why it is done, in fact, the sole reason why this forum exists; is to give and share the best onformation possible about ammunition, in the most responable way.
That means we not only use our common sense, but our knowledge of the law as well, because those are the parameters within we as collector need and should work.
A lot of collectors on this forum are able to collect ammunition because they have a license provided to them by the governement.
The governement gives, but you can be certain they will take it away in a heartbeat of something goes wrong.
It's about earning trust, showing to the governement that we as collectors are not the same as those who think they know it all and put everybody in danger.
More simply said: there are laws, and we as a forum have to live by them, wether you like it or not.
@Kz11 (and others), we deleted you're posts without a private message.
For this i apologise, there's just to much stuff going on in our proffesional lives that we sometimes forgot to do it properly.
@Kz11 (and others), we deleted you're posts without a private message.
For this i apologise, there's just to much stuff going on in our proffesional lives that we sometimes forgot to do it properly.
Hi Zünder .
Ok I note .
But can we have a "checklist" of the allowed pictures (or text) and the not allowed please + some examples .
Thank you in advance
Well, there is no checklist, but basically it's very simple:
if it's large calibre ammunition, and it obviously came out of the ground; it's not allowed.
Powdercharges: like you're 3,7: not allowed.
Every item that is considered illegal under the present gunlaws is not allowed.
But be assured, we guard this forum almost 24/7, and every picture we have our doubts about is taken out, discussed and saved.
Nothing is lost and we appreciate every kind of input no matter how small.
hassiman
30.08.2006, 11:42
This IS a tough one as I love to see the photographs of things as they were discovered... I find it fascinating... but I also realize how damn dangerous it is. I saw a photo on some Russian list of a digger opening live morter shells with a hammer and chisel... and also photos of them have fun burning the propellant. I have no idea how many of those people are still alive. Maybe none.
The bigger point is that we are guests here on this incredible list and it is only proper that we follow the rules of our ever gracious hosts. The international climate for this study has become a bit frosty of late and there is no sense giving anyone the ammunition ( sorry for the pun) to justify making this field any more restricted than it has already become.
Thanks to all who have put up with my silly questions these years.
Richard
We've had a few members who were apparently not aware of the "no live ammo" rule.
For those: please read this topic.
Sincerely: the wk2ammo team.
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